TED演講者：Shreya Joshi / 史瑞亞·喬希

演講標(biāo)題：What you can learn from people who disagree with you / 從意見相左的人身上可以學(xué)到什么

內(nèi)容概要：Youth leader Shreya Joshi diagnoses a key source of political polarization in the US and shows why having "uncomfortable conversations" with people you disagree with is crucial to bridging the divide. "When we are able to recognize what unites us, it becomes so much easier to have conversations about what divides us," she says.

青年領(lǐng)袖史瑞亞·喬希（Shreya Joshi）分析了美國(guó)政治兩極分化的一個(gè)關(guān)鍵原因，并說明了為什么與不同意我們的人進(jìn)行“不愉快的對(duì)話”對(duì)于彌合分歧至關(guān)重要。她說：“當(dāng)我們能夠認(rèn)識(shí)到是什么把我們團(tuán)結(jié)在一起時(shí)，就更容易就分歧的根源進(jìn)行對(duì)話?！薄?/p>

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【1】OK, guys, let's go back to high school.

好的,朋友們, 讓我們回到高中時(shí)代。

【2】Does anyone remember that feeling of walking into the school cafeteria with your tray in your hand and not knowing where to sit?

有沒有人還記得那種 端著托盤走進(jìn)學(xué)校食堂 卻不知道在哪里落座的感覺？

【3】Yeah, I see some people nodding, OK, cool.

嗯,我看到有人在點(diǎn)頭。

【4】You might have sat alone, or perhaps more likely, you looked for someone who felt familiar.

你可能會(huì)孤零零地找個(gè)座位坐著, 或者,更有可能是 找到一個(gè)感覺有點(diǎn)親近的人,

【5】You sat with a group of people that reminded you of you.

或者跟一群 與你處境相同的人坐下來。

【6】And even today, when deciding where to sit, how many of you chose to sit next to someone who looked or felt different from you?

即便在今天,在選擇座位時(shí), 在座有多少人會(huì)選擇, 坐在一個(gè)看起來或者 感覺跟你不一樣的人旁邊？

【7】I would bet that not many of you did that.

我敢打賭,沒有幾個(gè)人會(huì)這樣做。

【8】I guess not much changes in some situations, whether you're 17 or you're 70.

我猜,有些事情是不怎么會(huì) 隨著時(shí)間流逝而改變的, 無論你是 17 歲還是 70 歲。

【9】We've all likely felt this tendency to gravitate towards people who look, think and act like us.

我們都可能感覺到這種吸引力, 將我們推向那些 樣貌、思維和行為 都與我們相仿的人。

【10】It's comfortable, but it can also be harmful because this polarization that we face today isn't just about believing that the other side is factually wrong.

這會(huì)讓你覺得很輕松, 但也可能是有害的, 因?yàn)槲覀兘裉烀媾R的兩極分化 不只是相信另一方有事實(shí)上的錯(cuò)誤。

【11】We are beginning to see the other side as malevolent beings with a hateful and hidden agenda.

我們開始將另一方視為惡人, 他們心懷惡毒且不可告人的企圖。

【12】And you can see this.

你可以看出這一點(diǎn)。

【13】You can see this in the screaming cable news pundits, the politicians who vote down bills just because they come from the other side of the aisle.

你可以在尖叫著的 有線新聞專家的身上看到這一點(diǎn), 那些僅僅因?yàn)榉ò竵碜粤硪环?而投票否決法案的政客們。

【14】The hate groups that violently attack people who are different from themselves.

還有暴力攻擊與自己不同的人的 仇恨團(tuán)體。

【15】When I see these things as a teenager, I just feel so sad, so angry and so scared of this world that I'm soon going to be entering as an adult.

當(dāng)我作為一名青少年 看到這些事情時(shí), 我感到很難過,很憤怒, 我變得很害怕這個(gè)世界, 害怕我很快要作為一名成年人 踏入這個(gè)世界。

【16】But there's something that I found in having conversations with my peers that I think can be a path forward from all of this.

但是,我在與同齡人的交談中 發(fā)現(xiàn)了一些東西, 我認(rèn)為這是一條能讓我們?cè)竭^這一切, 更進(jìn)一步的路徑。

【17】An approach that focuses on conversations with the intent to listen and learn.

一種專注于 傾聽和學(xué)習(xí)的對(duì)話方法。

【18】Not to win and not to agree.

不為了贏也不為了附和。

【19】So I'm a 17-year-old from Naperville, Illinois.

我是一個(gè) 17 歲的青年, 來自伊利諾伊州的納珀維爾。

【20】In the summer before my sophomore year of high school, I attended the ACLU National Advocacy Institute's high school program in Washington, DC.

在我高中二年級(jí)的前一個(gè)夏天, 我參加了 美國(guó)公民自由聯(lián)盟國(guó)家倡導(dǎo)研究所 在華盛頓的高中項(xiàng)目。

【21】During this program, I had the chance to take part in a lot of different political discussions.

在這個(gè)項(xiàng)目中, 我有機(jī)會(huì)參加了許多不同的政治討論。

【22】And I remember this one conversation about the death penalty in particular.

我對(duì)一次關(guān)于死刑的談話記憶猶新。

【23】So back then, I wholeheartedly believed in this meaning of an eye for an eye.

當(dāng)時(shí), 我完全是以眼還眼的支持者。

【24】That punishment should be equal to the offense because, you know, that's what I grew up hearing.

我堅(jiān)信一個(gè)人的行為和相應(yīng)得到的懲罰 應(yīng)該是均等的, 因?yàn)檫@是我從小聽到的道理。

【25】And so I argued the same.

所以我也這么認(rèn)為。

【26】I was, however, met with immediate opposition.

然而,我立刻遭到了反對(duì)。

【27】My peers told me that the death penalty is state sanctioned murder and that it reinforces the very behavior that it's trying to suppress.

我的同伴告訴我, 死刑是國(guó)家批準(zhǔn)的謀殺, 這種懲罰強(qiáng)化了它正嘗試壓制的行為。

【28】I tried arguing that the death penalty deters crime, but then my peers told me that in states without the death penalty, the murder rate is actually significantly lower.

我試圖主張死刑可以阻止犯罪, 但后來我的同伴告訴我, 在沒有死刑的州, 謀殺率實(shí)際上要低得多。

【29】I then tried arguing that the death penalty brings closure for the victim's families, only to be told that the length between sentencing and execution actually puts the victim's families through an agonizing wait period.

然后,我試圖辯稱 死刑會(huì)給受害者的家人一個(gè)交代, 但卻被告知, 判決和處決之間的時(shí)間實(shí)際上 讓受害者的家人 經(jīng)歷了痛苦的等待期。

【30】So by this point, I realized that this debate -- Not going all that great for me.

所以到這里,我意識(shí)到這場(chǎng)辯論 對(duì)我來說并不是一帆風(fēng)順。

【31】I realized that my perspective was inherited, and this is when I decided to stop trying to win the debate, and instead I just listened.

我意識(shí)到我的觀點(diǎn)是守舊的, 這也是我決定放棄 試圖贏得辯論的時(shí)候, 并開始默默傾聽。

【32】And in the months that followed, I took it upon myself to learn more.

在接下來的幾個(gè)月里, 我開始自學(xué)更多。

【33】I pored over articles and data from sources ranging from the more liberal, like the Brennan Center for Justice, to the more conservative, like The Heritage Foundation.

我仔細(xì)閱讀了來自 不同來源的文章和數(shù)據(jù), 從相對(duì)更加自由的, 比如布倫南司法中心, 到更保守的,比如傳統(tǒng)基金會(huì)。

【34】And I learned that historically, capital punishment has been disproportionately applied to people of color.

我了解到,歷史上, 死刑對(duì)有色人種的 使用比例過高。

【35】And that the death penalty isn’t actually proven to deter crime.

而且事實(shí)上,死刑并不能阻止犯罪。

【36】Slowly, my thinking changed.

慢慢地,我的想法變了。

【37】And this change only happened because I engaged with people who had opposing perspectives.

這種變化之所以發(fā)生, 是因?yàn)槲医佑|了 那些持相反觀點(diǎn)的人。

【38】You know, it's hard to break out of your own echo chamber because most of the time we don't realize that we're even in one until we're out of it.

你知道,很難走出 你自己的回聲和固有思維, 因?yàn)榇蠖鄶?shù)時(shí)候, 我們?cè)谧叱鰜碇? 都不會(huì)意識(shí)到 我們甚至處于這個(gè)空間里。

【39】But this was my first step.

但這是我的第一步。

【40】So shortly after this experience, I started a nonpartisan initiative called Project TEAL to encourage and empower high school students to become politically involved.

因此,在這段經(jīng)歷后不久, 我發(fā)起了一項(xiàng)名為 “TEAL項(xiàng)目”的無黨派倡議, 以鼓勵(lì)和增強(qiáng)高中生的 政治參與能力。

【41】We discuss a lot of different issues like education equity, voter suppression, racial justice.

我們討論了許多不同的問題, 如教育公平、 選民壓制、種族公正。

【42】And I've seen some amazing things happen when people just talk to one another.

通過這個(gè)項(xiàng)目, 我看到了當(dāng)人們相互交談時(shí) 發(fā)生的一些令人驚奇的事情。

【43】Understanding and accepting of our differences.

理解并接受我們的不同。

【44】I actually remember this one conversation in the summer of 2020.

我記得 2020 年夏天的一次對(duì)話。

【45】There was a boy and a girl who were debating the merit of the Black Lives Matter movement.

有一個(gè)男孩和一個(gè)女孩在辯論 “黑人的命也是命”（BLM） 運(yùn)動(dòng)的優(yōu)點(diǎn)。

【46】And I remember being afraid that their conversation would evolve into an argument.

我記得我擔(dān)心 他們的談話會(huì)演變成爭(zhēng)論。

【47】But it didn't.

但事實(shí)并非如此。

【48】Instead, I learned that the girl, who is Black, came from a family that had been through a couple of rough instances with the police.

相反,我得知這名黑人女孩, 來自一個(gè) 曾與警方發(fā)生過 幾次暴力事件的家庭。

【49】And the boy, who was the son of a cop, came from an upbringing in which BLM was labeled as a movement in defiance of the police.

這名男孩是一名警察的兒子, 且被灌輸?shù)氖?BLM是一種藐視警察的運(yùn)動(dòng)。

【50】Later on, I was surprised to learn that, though they still didn't agree, the boy and the girl learned something about the other that they didn't know before.

后來,我驚訝地得知, 盡管他們?nèi)匀粺o法認(rèn)同對(duì)方的觀點(diǎn), 但男孩和女孩了解了一些 他們以前不知道的事情。

【51】And more than that, they appreciated how it shaped the other person's unique perspective.

不僅如此, 他們還發(fā)現(xiàn)了這些背景 如何塑造了對(duì)方獨(dú)特的視角。

【52】And this was only possible because they didn't delve into a shouting match or call each other disrespectful names.

這一切成為可能的原因, 是因?yàn)樗麄儧]有陷入口水仗, 也沒有侮辱對(duì)方。

【53】And for me, this was an “aha!” moment.

對(duì)我來說, 這是一個(gè)頓悟時(shí)刻。

【54】I realized that we shouldn't back away from discussing polarizing issues, even if it's with people who disagree with us.

我意識(shí)到,我們不應(yīng)該 回避討論兩極分化的問題, 即使是與不同意我們觀點(diǎn)的人。

【55】Sure, it's uncomfortable, and yeah, I'd probably agree that we don't change our minds most of the time.

當(dāng)然,這很不舒服, 是的,我可能同意, 我們大多數(shù)時(shí)候都不會(huì)改變主意。

【56】But we can better understand opposing perspectives, which can help us to better advocate for our own beliefs.

但我們可以更好地理解對(duì)立的觀點(diǎn), 這可以幫助我們 更好地支持自己的信仰。

【57】And maybe, just maybe, it even allows us to reach a compromise when the situation demands it.

也許,只是也許, 它甚至可以讓我們 在形勢(shì)需要時(shí)達(dá)成妥協(xié)。

【58】So I think the question remains.

所以我認(rèn)為問題仍然存在。

【59】How can we create space for this kind of bipartisan discourse?

我們?nèi)绾螢檫@種兩黨對(duì)話創(chuàng)造空間？

【60】Well, I think the first step is finding a community.

嗯,我認(rèn)為第一步是找到一個(gè)集體。

【61】When I think back to my experience in the ACLU, I think the reason we were able to have that civil discourse was because we recognized that we were a part of a greater cause.

當(dāng)我回想我在 美國(guó)公民自由聯(lián)盟的經(jīng)歷時(shí), 我認(rèn)為我們之所以 能夠進(jìn)行禮貌的對(duì)話, 是因?yàn)槲覀冋J(rèn)識(shí)到 我們是一個(gè)更偉大事業(yè)的一部分。

【62】And it's because my peers knew me, not just as an opposing voice, but as Shreya, their peer, their fellow teen activist and their friend.

是因?yàn)槲业耐閭?不僅僅把我看作一個(gè)反對(duì)的聲音, 還把我看作史瑞雅—— 他們的伙伴、他們的 青少年活動(dòng)家同伴和他們的朋友。

【63】And when we are able to recognize what unites us, it becomes so much easier to have conversations about what divides us.

當(dāng)我們能夠認(rèn)識(shí)到 是什么把我們團(tuán)結(jié)在一起時(shí), 就更容易就那些讓我們產(chǎn)生分歧的事 進(jìn)行對(duì)話。

【64】And most Americans actually validate what I have seen in practice.

大多數(shù)美國(guó)人實(shí)際上都證實(shí)了 我在實(shí)踐中看到的現(xiàn)象。

【65】While 77 percent of American voters polled before the 2020 presidential election said that they had just a few or no close friends who supported the other side's candidate, 79 percent of Americans agree

盡管在 2020 年總統(tǒng)大選前 接受調(diào)查的 77% 的美國(guó)選民表示, 他們只有個(gè)別, 甚至沒有支持對(duì)方候選人的密友, 但 79% 的美國(guó)人同意,

【66】that creating opportunities for bipartisan civil discourse would be effective in reducing divisions.

為兩黨公民對(duì)話創(chuàng)造機(jī)會(huì) 將有效減少分歧。

【67】Seventy-nine percent.

百分之七十九。

【68】That's pretty incredible, if you ask me.

在我看來,這也太不可思議了。

【69】We all have affinity groups that we can join.

我們都能加入 與我們有共同點(diǎn)的群體。

【70】Maybe it's a friend group at your place of work, a book club at the local library or the PTA at your kid's school.

也許是工作上的朋友圈, 當(dāng)?shù)貓D書館的讀書會(huì), 或者你孩子學(xué)校的家長(zhǎng)會(huì)。

【71】Whatever this group is, try to have an uncomfortable conversation with them at least once a week.

無論這群人是誰, 嘗試著每周至少與他們 進(jìn)行一次別扭的交談。

【72】Now, OK, what exactly constitutes as uncomfortable?

好,所以這種“別扭” 指的到底是什么？

【73】I would say that's really up for you to decide.

我想說,這真的取決于你自己。

【74】It can be about politics, sure.

當(dāng)然,這可能與政治有關(guān)。

【75】Or it can be about a different topic entirely, like religion or identity.

也可以是一個(gè)完全不同的話題, 比如宗教或身份。

【76】Whatever this topic may be, just talk about something that’s uncomfortable, unconventional and meaningful to you.

無論這個(gè)話題是什么, 嘗試去談?wù)撘恍?duì)你來說 不舒服、不合常規(guī) 和有意義的話題。

【77】And most importantly, do it with the intent to listen and learn, not to win and not to agree.

最重要的是, 以傾聽和學(xué)習(xí)為目的去做這件事, 而不是獲勝和認(rèn)同。

【78】And you know, another tip.

還有另一個(gè)小貼士。

【79】Make sure to stay off of your phone for this conversation.

確保在本次對(duì)話中遠(yuǎn)離手機(jī)。

【80】Yeah.

沒錯(cuò)。

【81】You know, as someone who's pretty much obsessed with TikTok, I completely understand how addicting social media can be.

你知道,作為一個(gè) 非常癡迷 TikTok 的人, 我完全理解社交媒體有多讓人上頭。

【82】Believe me.

相信我。

【83】But by discussing polarizing issues online, we lose that person-to-person connection that really humanizes opposing perspectives, that allows us to see and empathize with one another.

但通過在網(wǎng)上討論兩極分化的問題, 我們失去了真正 將對(duì)立觀點(diǎn)人性化的 那種人與人之間的聯(lián)系, 而它讓我們能夠 看清彼此并感同身受。

【84】Because by having these conversations, you will gain insight into people who think differently than you do.

因?yàn)橥ㄟ^這些對(duì)話, 你會(huì)洞察那些與你想法不同的人。

【85】And who knows, maybe you'll convince someone of a belief that you hold dearly, or maybe you'll even be moved to reconsider your own viewpoint.

誰知道呢,也許你會(huì)讓某人 相信你珍視的信仰, 或者你甚至受到感染 重新考慮自己的觀點(diǎn)。

【86】In a month's time, I'm going to be graduating from high school.

再過一個(gè)月,我就要高中畢業(yè)了。

【87】(Applause) Over the past four years, I’ve learned a lot about creating positive discourse, but I’m still scared of this polarization, this growing unwillingness to view those who politically disagree with us as human.

（掌聲） 在過去的四年里, 我學(xué)到了很多關(guān)于 創(chuàng)造積極談話的知識(shí), 但我仍然害怕這種兩極分化, 這種不愿意把那些 在政治上與我們意見相左的人 視為人的觀點(diǎn)。

【88】Honestly, it's a little overwhelming to think that I'm soon going to enter this reality where I'll be confronted with this division.

老實(shí)說,我很快就要 踏入這個(gè)現(xiàn)實(shí)中了, 在那里,我將面臨這種分裂, 這讓我有點(diǎn)不知所措。

【89】Where I’ll be stereotyped and judged by my ideology, my identity and my way of thinking by people who don't even know the real me.

在那里,我的意識(shí)形態(tài)、身份 和思維方式會(huì)被那些 甚至不了解真實(shí)我的人定型和評(píng)判。

【90】As a teenager, it's a lot.

對(duì)于一個(gè)青少年來說,這很沉重。

【91】And I know that many of my fellow Gen Zers feel the exact same way.

我知道我的許多 95 后、00 后小伙伴 也有同樣的感受。

【92】And this is precisely why addressing this polarization crisis is so urgent and demands action from all of us.

這正是為什么解決這場(chǎng) 兩極分化的危機(jī)如此迫切, 需要我們所有人采取行動(dòng)。

【93】Just for one moment, go back to that high school cafeteria, But this time you sit down with that other crowd.

只需要占用一點(diǎn)你的時(shí)間, 回到高中食堂, 但這次,你要和其他人坐在一起。

【94】The kids who didn't look or think like you do.

坐在那些看起來或思想 和你不一樣的同學(xué)身邊。

【95】And just imagine what you could have learned.

想象一下你能學(xué)到什么。

【96】Thank you.

謝謝。

【97】(Applause)